En Espaniol

[osuche]

Bush Opposes Singing Anthem in Spanish
By TERENCE HUNT, AP White House Correspondent
Fri Apr 28, 10:54 PM ET


WASHINGTON - President Bush said Friday the national anthem should be sung in English — not Spanish — in a blunt rejection of a new Spanish-language version. He also expressed opposition to a national work stoppage called for Monday to dramatize the importance of immigrants to the U.S. economy.

Bush made his comments at a Rose Garden news conference as a Spanish-language version of "The Star-Spangled Banner," hit the airways featuring artists such as Wyclef Jean, hip-hop star Pitbull and Puerto Rican singers Carlos Ponce and Olga Tanon.

Called "Nuestro Himno" — "Our Anthem" — the Spanish version rewrites some of the English version. For instance, the second stanza says, "My people keep fighting. It's time to break the chains."

"I think people who want to be a citizen of this country ought to learn English and they ought to learn to sing the national anthem in English," Bush said.



What do you think?

[Fangtasia]

Well if it were my national anthem i'd want it sang in my language...

[wyndhy]

the US does not have an "official language" and it's part of our proud heritage to be a melting pot of all kinds of nationalities. many languages are and have been spoken by our citizens.
that being said, i do believe that the nat'l anthem shoulnd't be messed around with. translating the song in different languages is one thing, but to change the lyrics, the rhythm and the title is another. imho, it's not our national anthem.

[PantyFanatic]

I’m not sure if the work stoppage is going to have the desired effect or if it would be good for either side. I do agree with the president that any one who is becoming a citizen should learn our national anthem in the language of the land and I’d add our pledge of allegiance to that. I also do not believe ANYBODY has the authority to rewrite our national anthem OR our constitution ……………….. including him!

[Scarecrow]

IMHO the work stoppage will just alienate more people against the ILLEGAL immigrants and not help their cause. I have heard more and more legal immigrants talk agains the illegal immigrants actions. As for the National Anthem, do not change the words or it is no longer the National Anthem but an imatation or parity.

[Irish]

IMHO the work stoppage will just alienate more people against the ILLEGAL immigrants and not help their cause. I have heard more and more legal immigrants talk agains the illegal immigrants actions. As for the National Anthem, do not change the words or it is no longer the National Anthem but an imatation or parity.
Well said!I agree! Irish
P.S.I'm not against immigrants,just illegal immigrants!

[PantyFanatic]

.....I'm not against immigrants,just illegal immigrants!
Also well said!

[Lilith]

My opinion is that it is a protest song not a spanish version of our national anthem. I of course have no problem with protest songs.

[jseal]

Gentlefolk,

I wonder if the French would accept people signing the La Marseillaise in English as a sign of patriotism. I can see it now… nah... but the image is amusing. :rolleyes:

This is a political statement.

Incidentally, there are already different versions of the Star Spangled Banner, including Gospel and Country. Many fans butcher it when it is played before the game starts. It survived Jimi Hendrix’s rendition in 1969. It will survive this trial.

[Booger]

I see no problem with the national anthem haveing a Spanish-language version. The US is a country of many difernt cultures that are celebrated in many diferbt way. No one say anything about Polish days, October fest, tulip time, St. Patricks day or any other such celebration that people have to celebrate there heritage. But some how when someone who isn't of europen descent celebrates there heritage it unamerican.



It survived Jimi Hendrix’s rendition in 1969. It will survive this trial.

There is nothing wrong with Jimi Hendrix's rendition of the national anthem. Just because he didn't play it note for note he played it with more feeling then most everyone else dose.

[osuche]

I think the national anthem needs to refect the heritage and emotion of the people in the country, and Spanish-speaking Americans are quickly becoming a huge constituency in the US.

Since I do not speak Spanish...I cannot judge. But I have been told that some of the meaning has been changed in the new version. If that's true, then I tend to believe (like Lilith) that this is a protest song, not the Anthem.

[jseal]

Booger,

I can't say that I agree with your positions.
...But some how when someone who isn't of europen descent celebrates there heritage it unamerican...
If it is not too great a burden, would you be kind enough to explain how a Spanish rendition of the national anthem of the United States of America is a celebration of the heritage of Guatemalans, Hondurans, Mexicans, or Nicaraguans? Or perhaps you are suggesting that there are Polish, German, and Gaelic renditions of the Star Spangled Banner – and that these renditions have been well received?

I suspect that this version of the Star Spangled Banner is a political statement advanced to promote Latin(o/a) inclusion because Congress has failed to come up with useful immigration reform.

While the good Mr. Hendrix may have, in your estimation, “played it with more feeling then most everyone else dose [sic]”, I believe that his rendition is not one commonly played before the opening of popular events – baseball, football, basketball, lacrosse, etc. While the demonstrated preference for other versions may have many explanations, one likely one is that Mr. Hendrix’s rendition is usually considered inappropriate.

Should you be interested, you can follow this link for other occasions of the Star-Mangled Banner (http://www.infoplease.com/spot/starmangledbanner.html).

[Oldfart]

As a foreigner, I look at this from outside the zone of emotion (this time).

Surely if they wish to sing the national anthem, a song revelling in the joys of being an American, then surely giving voice to your commitment to your country transcends language.

As far as not having an official language, try giving your tax return in Uzbek or answering a cross-examination in erse.

[PantyFanatic]

.....As far as not having an official language, try giving your tax return in Uzbek ......
:D :D :D


I LOVE it! What a great idea. :D

[Lilith]

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p4269.pdf

http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/article/0,,id=98970,00.html

[PantyFanatic]

I kind of like Bengali :D






<--- *thinks Lilith came up with those WAY too fast* :rolleyes:

[campingboy]

I see this as a protest song too.

On a side note, I find the US National Anthem to be very beautiful IF sung correctly. That is a big ‘if’. It is a very hard anthem, and I have heard more versions that are more painful to listen to then a pleasure. There is that one part where I’m almost tense waiting to see if the singer can reach the high notes clearly.

I was listening to a radio show that was talking about how the Spanish speaking population will displace the Afro-American population in both social economic and political standing within 20 years. One Political Science Professor thought that there will be a Spanish speaking President before there will be an Afro-American one.

[Lilith]

I believe that may be the case as well. I know that Hispanics are rapidly reaching the "majority minority." I also think the idea of a Hispanic American president being elected prior to an African American president may have something to do with the fact that many Hispanic Americans register as Republicans and many African Americans register as Democrats. Currently I view the Democrats as the more complacent party.

[campingboy]

Another fact is that many New Immigrants feel that it is a privilege to Vote, and do so. I'm not as convinced that the African American population turns out to vote in the same percentages.

The question of what to do with the ‘illegal Immigrants’ is a difficult one. Deport all of them? I’m not sure of the process of deporting some in the US, but I think it goes something like this – Immigration officer investigates case, arrests said person, person is held in jail, a court case is set, judge hears case, guilty person is deported to another country. Now multiply that by all the illegal immigrants and that is a lot of time and money. Is this the best use of Government money? Can it be justified to spend more money on deporting someone then what it spends on the education and health care of a legal American?

[PantyFanatic]

.... – Immigration officer investigates case, arrests said person, person is held in jail, a court case is set, judge hears case, guilty person is deported to another country. Now multiply that by all the illegal immigrants and that is a lot of time and money. Is this the best use of Government money? Can it be justified to spend more money on deporting someone then what it spends on the education and health care of a legal American?
GOOD point.

[osuche]

I kind of like Bengali :D



I'll have to tell my Bengali husband to file his tax forms in his native tongue. :D

Now *that* will be the day! :D

I agree about the use of govt resources...we can use $$ to put illegal immigrants in jail and deport them, or to help them become productive citizens. Which do I prefer??? I suspect the choice is obvious.

[jseal]

...I agree about the use of govt resources...we can use $$ to put illegal immigrants in jail and deport them, or to help them become productive citizens. Which do I prefer??? I suspect the choice is obvious.

Yes indeed!

[Fangtasia]

I'm in the deport them catergory...but then thats me...Illegal is illegal

The jobs they take and the 'help' they require to become legal productive citizens would cost more than sending em home in a canoe

[Neige]

Canada has versions of its national anthem in the two official languages, French and English (and was, in fact, first written in French). The two versions do not say the exact same things, as seems to be the case with the Spanish and English versions of the American national anthem.

(Official English version)
O Canada!
Our home and native land!
True patriot love in all thy sons command.
With glowing hearts we see thee rise,
The True North strong and free!
From far and wide,
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.
God keep our land glorious and free!
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.
O Canada, we stand on guard for thee.

(Translation of the French version)
O Canada! Land of our forefathers
Thy brow is wreathed with a glorious garland of flowers.
As in thy arm ready to wield the sword,
So also is it ready to carry the cross.
Thy history is an epic of the most brilliant exploits.
Thy valour steeped in faith
Will protect our homes and our rights
Will protect our homes and our rights.

More info on the Canadian national anthem here (http://www.pch.gc.ca/progs/cpsc-ccsp/sc-cs/anthem_e.cfm).

[rabbit]

"I think people who want to be a citizen of this country ought to learn English and they ought to learn to sing the national anthem in English," Bush said.



What do you think?


Goddamn right!

[Booger]

I'm in the deport them catergory...but then thats me...Illegal is illegal

The jobs they take and the 'help' they require to become legal productive citizens would cost more than sending em home in a canoe

The only problem is most aren't taking jobs form anyone in reality here in the US. Most are doing jobs no one else would do for the pay they get. A lot of them work with forged paper which it would be easy for the goverment to track down if they realy wanted to. Why don't they for two reasons one they have taxes and S.S. taken out of their check and don't file taxes so the goverment gets to keep all the money. The other eason if they weren't here willing to work for the low pay it everyone would end up paying in the end. I know in another thread there was a coment made about picking apples well if they were picking them the farmers would have to pay some one twice what they are now to get them picked then when you went to the store to buy one you would end up paying more in the end.

[Fangtasia]

Thats your opinion hun...

Mine is still the same...come in by the right channels and your welcome...come in illegally and ya can get ya ass back to where ya came from cause i'm not interested...never will be and i aint interested in ya sob story either

[Booger]

Originally Posted by osuche
"I think people who want to be a citizen of this country ought to learn English and they ought to learn to sing the national anthem in English," Bush said.



What do you think?


Goddamn right!

First off Mr. Rabbit you and Mr. Bush have to learn Engklish isn't the US's offical language WE DON"T HAVE ONE. Second the US is a melting pot I'd be willing to bet that the first generations of your family didn't speak english either unless all you decsendents were from an english speaking country.

[Fangtasia]

The United States does not have an official language; nevertheless, American English (referred to in the US as simply English) is the language used for legislation, regulations, executive orders, treaties, federal court rulings, and all other official pronouncements. Additionally, one must demonstrate an ability to read, write, and speak English to become a naturalized citizen. Many individual states and territories have also adopted English as their official language:

Alabama, Alaska, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kentucky, Massachusetts, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, New Hampshire, North Carolina, North Dakota, South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee, the U.S. Virgin Islands, Utah, Virginia, West Virginia, and Wyoming

Several states and territories are officially bilingual:

Louisiana (English and French),
New Mexico (English and Spanish),
Hawaii (Hawaiian English and Hawaiian),
Puerto Rico (Spanish and English),
Guam (Chamorro and English),
American Samoa (Samoan and English);
And one is officially trilingual:

Northern Mariana Islands (English, Chamorro, and Carolinian).

Taken from Wikipedia

[LixyChick]

I've always liked the Jimi Hendrix version of the anthem...and never met a person who considered it inappropriate. I might just have to get out more...lol!

As to the Spanish version? I agree that it's more of a protest song than a tribute since the lyrics have been changed. It's not like the words can't be translated exactly so they changed them to the next best translatable (word?...is now!) word.

Hey! It's early here...and I know what I mean^^^^^

[osuche]

PixieSprite, that's interesting. I always assumed that the words and meaning were about the same!

[lakritze]

This is a midterm election year. The "illegal immigrant problem" surfaced in 2006 just like the same sex marriage issue surfaced in 2004. My favourite rendition of the National Anthem? Jimi Hendrix of course.

[rabbit]

First off Mr. Rabbit you and Mr. Bush have to learn Engklish isn't the US's offical language WE DON"T HAVE ONE. Second the US is a melting pot I'd be willing to bet that the first generations of your family didn't speak english either unless all you decsendents were from an english speaking country.

Mr. Booger, you are right. My grandparents, ENGLISH illiterate, emigrated to this country at the turn of the century....LEGALLY I MIGHT ADD. They waited their turn. And when they got here, they learned English. When they became US citizens, they made the pledge in English. It was an important part of their journey to become Americans.

I would respectfully suggest that you get off your high liberal horse and accept that people who are born here have a native tongue...English. Those who emigrate here must learn it. It is not for America to bow to those not willing to learn.

On this one, George W. Bush is 100% correct.

(steps down now)

[scotzoidman]

I was wondering when someone was gonna start flingin' the L-word into the discussion...nothing raises the level of discourse like name-calling...

[Lilith]

It's usually about page 3, maybe 4.

[jseal]

Gentlefolk,

I’d like to see the barriers to immigration lowered, but the requirement for naturalization include an 8th Grade English requirement. I read somewhere that that is the grade level to which the broadsheets write, so it seems to be a reasonable base line.

I guess one issue, real or imagined, is national security. Until someone is an American citizen, I can see that there could be questions raised about allegiances. OK. But assuming that that hurdle can be overcome, what really is the big deal about immigration? Too many applicants? Too many of the wrong type? Seriously, what’s the big deal about this person or that person working in the U.S.?

[Fangtasia]

jseal

As i see it, most have no issue with immigrants...what seems to be the issue is the way they come into the country (any country that is)

Illegal is just that....Illegal

[bare4you]

It's amazing that all the discourse these days surrounds the subject of immigrants and they always seem to leave out the word illegal when referring to their status.

As for the national anthem, the tune is an old pub song from England but the words are American written in English. Do we try and translate other country's anthem's because we can't speak their language or to suit our needs?

I don't see many illegal aliens (yea, they used to be called that at one time) trying to sneak into Mexico to make a living...or trying to sneak into Iraq or Iran or Afghanistan to make a living.

If you can't speak the language then how the hell do you expect to fill out a tax form? Oh sorry - how narrow minded of me to think you actually pay taxes!

[Booger]

If you can't speak the language then how the hell do you expect to fill out a tax form? Oh sorry - how narrow minded of me to think you actually pay taxes!

bare4you if you'll note from Liliths post here the IRS put out taxe froms in almost all languages. As far as the illegal paying taxes as siad earleir in this thread most of the illegal Mexicans in this country have fourged papers. When they get a job it's just like you and me the money is taken from ther check but due to the fact they don't want to draw attention to themselves the don't file their taxes so the goverment ends up keeping it all. AS for the others with out papers they most likely are getting paid under the table in cash. I find it funny that some find it easy to blame them for not paying taxes when the people who hire them no one says a word about and they are realy the ones getting away not payingf because they don't pay all the other taxes that have to be paid on any empoly. Plus they generaly are paying less then the minimum wage. If you truely want to stop the illegals form coming into this country. They should make penalties for these people more harsh. If they was no one willing to take the chance to hire them they wouldn't come here.



http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p4269.pdf

http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/article/0,,id=98970,00.html

[Fangtasia]

I dont mind Booger....if you want em you can have em....less Australia will see then :)

[jseal]

... They should make penalties for these people more harsh. If they was no one willing to take the chance to hire them they wouldn't come here.
Booger,

Who benefits from the harsher penalties you propose? Who benefits from the jobs that would not be created or filled? Who benefits from the remittances that would not be sent home to their families? Who benefits from the lower tax revenues?

This would be good for whom? What are the benefits your proposals bring to all concerned?

As an alternative to MORE laws to conserve what we have, how about adopting a more liberal approach, FEWER laws?

[WildIrish]

As an alternative to MORE laws to conserve what we have, how about adopting a more liberal approach, FEWER laws?


Why do we need new laws when there are already laws on the books stating that hiring illegal aliens is illegal? Can't we just enforce the existing statutes?

Personally, I think the time it takes to become a citizen is way too long. I'm not saying it should be handed out at the submittal of an application, but I've known people that've finally been granted citizenship after ten years of trying! And the process isn't cheap either, believe me. Bottom line is, going about it the right way goes a little farther beyond "weeding out the people that don't really want it". We can land remote control go-carts on Mars...why can't we figure out a way to make this issue work?

And that whole "wall between Texas and Mexico" idea? If they kick the illegals out...who will build the wall? Why don't they have the illegals build the wall, and then when they're done...say "Wow, this side looks great! What's the other side look like?" and when they go around to see.......lock the gate! :D

[bare4you]

The more I think about this (how can you not with all the press it's getting these days) I have to agree there is a problem in 3 areas:

The employers who are breaking the law
The people who enter the country illegally
There needs to be a stronger presence at the border - The Minute Men have the right idea for me

I have no problem with people coming to the States legally. Most of our ancestors were legal immigrants at one time or another. I have a major problem though with those that are here illegally and now are demanding that we forget how they got here.

Has anyone else noticed that more and more products in the stores have bilingual labels/packaging?

[Neige]

Has anyone else noticed that more and more products in the stores have bilingual labels/packaging?

Is this Spanish and English?

[PantyFanatic]

Is this Spanish and English?
Chinese! .....And I hope they don't finish that wall before WE can get in.








ROFL :D

[osuche]

Is this Spanish and English?


When I worked for a consumer goods company, we were transitioning to packages for North America which were tri-lingual ---- English, Spanish, and French. Many of this company's packages have all 3.

[jseal]

osuche,

I’m seeing it at the grocery store. The “International Isle” now contains many more products marketed towards the Latino community than it did, say, four years ago.

[osuche]

I used to manage a food ingredients business about a year ago....and I made several trips to Mexico. Many of the local Mexican food companies were exporting -- chiefly to the US and Canada. Exports made up 30-40% of the company's production, and 70-80% of the profits. Mexican nationals in the US had a greater willingness to pay for Mexican foods and drinks, and also made more money (so they were able to pay).

There's big business in the business of ethnic foods!

[Neige]

There's big business in the business of ethnic foods!

Give me ethnic food anyday - it's my personal opinion that it tastes sooooo much better than typically American food!

[jseal]

PixieSprite,

When these immigrants are Americans, then typically American food will be better. :)

[osuche]

LOL @ jseal's comment. My husband *loves* meatloaf, and eggs, and all foods American. I think it's th enovelty effect of growing up Indian.

Me? I could live on Asian food, pasta, and Mexican. :p I won't let meatloaf pass my lips. Ever. And I hate eggs.

We compromise and eat what I like. :p

[jseal]

^^^ LOL @osuche! ^^