This makes me angry

[Cheyanne]

Police Arrest, Handcuff 8-Year-Old For Tantrum
Child Charged With Disorderly Conduct, Assault, Battery

POSTED: 10:21 am CST March 4, 2005

WILLIAMSBURG, Va. -- Police arrested an 8-year-old boy who allegedly had a violent outburst in school, head-butting his teacher and kicking an assistant principal, when he was told he couldn't go outside to play with other students.

The 4-foot pupil was led away from Rawls Byrd Elementary School in handcuffs Tuesday and charged with disorderly conduct and assault and battery.

"It's not something that happens every day," Maj. Stan Stout said of what could be the department's youngest arrestee ever.

Stout said the chair-tossing, desk-turning outburst occurred after a teacher, and later the assistant principal, attempted to stop the boy from joining his classmates.

The child was later released to his parents.

[Cheyanne]

This just makes me sooooooooo MAD!

I am surrounded by kids every day...... and even I can see with an untrained eye, when a child is feeling so frustrated to the point of bursting and have the tools to be able to calm a child down! Granted, I was not present, and the article doesn't explain any specifics as to what led up to the outburst or tantrum as they called it. But I would have hoped that PRIOR to the action taken (handcuffs? jail?) that the school system (teacher and asst.principal) could have somehow calmed this CHILD down.

OK.. off rant.. :(

[Sharni]

Serve the little shit right.....i bet he calmed down then and will think twice before doing it again

[PantyFanatic]

Police Arrest, Handcuff 8-Year-Old For Tantrum
Child Charged With Disorderly Conduct, Assault, Battery

POSTED: 10:21 am CST March 4, 2005

WILLIAMSBURG, Va. -- Police arrested an 8-year-old boy who allegedly had a violent outburst in school, head-butting his teacher and kicking an assistant principal, when he was told he couldn't go outside to play with other students.
......Stout said the chair-tossing, desk-turning outburst occurred after a teacher, and later the assistant principal, attempted to stop the boy from joining his classmates.....

What am I missing? :confused:

I don’t know if the police were stationed at the school, but they had to be called at some point…………… after the teacher couldn’t squelch the situation …….after the asst. principal was brought into it………..

Since our teachers are subject to being sued if they paddle a kids ass when they are totally out of control, what else would you suggest to get his attention?

Just a layman’s thought, but it seems being allowed to carryout such actions is what made an eight year old comfortable enough to take them to school.

Perhaps a crash course in Astronomy 101 would show him that the universe doesn’t revolve around his ass, ………… and a paddle can.


:cents:

[Cheyanne]

Since our teachers are subject to being sued if they paddle a kids ass when they are totally out of control, what else would you suggest to get his attention?

You are right on that one PF... teachers are subject to being sued by parents who think their little devil is actually an angel....

I guess I am a little over sensitive about drastic steps like this.. :( Again, like I said before the article doesn't say if this behavior is one that the kid exhibited before or what exactly led up to it, but I wonder if there were clues to this leading up to the outburst? That was what I was questioning and why I was so mad about it. Much, not all, of the behavior of a student can be predicted by what they are experiencing and can be curtailed prior to reaching eruption stage.

Upon reflection, I know that many districts call the police as a last resort. Maybe this behavior was typical of the child? I don't know, but it makes me sad and mad that it had to happen to an 8 year old. And hopefully this child will learn a lesson....

[Scarecrow]

Chey I 'm around that age group all day also and I would like to know how come he head butted a teacher, no parental guidence???

[PantyFanatic]

..... Maybe this behavior was typical of the child? I don't know, but it makes me sad and mad that it had to happen to an 8 year old. And hopefully this child will learn a lesson....
We only have the action and reaction that had to be taken in this report. You are right about some sad conditions had to precede these final events. :( Short of Damion reincarnate,:yikes: eight years of adult influence didn’t happen.:whack: Our vulnerable teachers are left to deal with the result.:hair:

Regardless of the facts that paved the way, the situation stated had to be ENDED!…… NOW!…….. and with consequences!... for the sake of our valuable teachers and every other child in the school.



:cents:



Now about your avatar....... :jump:
:drool: :D :drool:

[Lilith]

:D as a future head butt recipient :D I wonder if the school has a DARE officer there who got involved.

If the situation could not have been prevented by a proactive (as opposed to a reactive) teacher then someone who was properly trained in restraint should have dealt with the child. Then again liability is the single greatest threat to my profession.

[PantyFanatic]

I consider the ratio of attention to “a DARE officer”, “properly trained in restraint”, “liability is the single greatest threat”, to TEACHING, a sin.


:cents:

[BigBear57]

I know from some teacher friends of mine the ever increasing behavioral problems with "crack babies" seems to present problems like this one. No standard procedures can cover these kids. They're off the walls at times and the one who needs the real ass beating is the parent who did crack and became a parent. Just my 2 cents worth.

[dicksbro]

Unfortunately, things have become very sad in some school districts. Teachers are tormented by kids with no parental support or school board help. Everyone's afraid of being sued. I think there ought to be a hot line to the judges and attorneys that caused this situation and they be brought in to deal with the unruly kids.

Personally, I think the teacher should sue the parents!

[Lilith]

But the answer to the woes of our education system is of course, testing and teacher accountability :spin:

[Scarecrow]

Teachers today can only teach to the lowest common level of the students in their room. And they want to mainstream the EMH students.

[lonelyarmywife]

But the answer to the woes of our education system is of course, testing and teacher accountability :spin:

Do NOT get me started on testing and All Children Left Behind.

As a teacher, here's my thoughts.

First, the child was told he couldn't go out to play. What did he do to deserve this? Teachers don't just take away rewards indiscriminately.

Then he headbutted the teacher. In my state, all teachers are trained in crisis management and know how to physically and safely restrained children. I thought it was the same in all states but maybe not. Anywho, that's assult on a teacher, which is a felony in most states, I believe.

then he threw a chair at the principal. So now he's using weapons.

Understand if someone touches this child, they open themselves up to a mess of liability, personal and professional. Of course most teachers associations actually carry malpractice insureance for situations such as this (i.e. the teacher needs to defend herself and gets sued in the process).

That's alot to say a little, but I'm curious how much more teachers are going to be asked to take without any recourse available to them. In my school alone this year we ahve had $450 stolen from teachers, and three teachers wind up with injuries of some sort from breaking up fights. I do not work in an inner city school - it's in the burbs. We are kicked, hit, scratched, insulted, spit on, abused, lied to on a consistant basis. yet we are still required to educate these little darling not only in our subject matter but also in life skills, social skills, and family matters. And if it doesn't sink in, it could mean our jobs.

I'm not glad an eight year old had to get arrested, but it's high time for the kids to start being held accountable for their own actions. We are doing them no favors by making excuses and rationalizing their behavior. Maybe this will teach the kid that there are otehr ways to deal with problems. I hope he gets some counseling and I hope they get the whole family in on it.

Those of you still reading, thanks. I now officially step down off my soapbox, and leave it for someone else to pick up from here.

:rant:

[Lilith]

I'm not glad an eight year old had to get arrested, but it's high time for the kids to start being held accountable for their own actions.

:rant:

Problem is that the real culprits in these situations are never held accountable, the parents. There's now accountability for everyone, except the ones who matter most.

[PantyFanatic]

I’ve had the opportunity to first hand witness and experience the integration of lawyers, psychologists and educators over the past ½ century. The changes have been great and the result has NOT!

[Cheyanne]

Problem is that the real culprits in these situations are never held accountable, the parents. There's now accountability for everyone, except the ones who matter most.

You have hit the nail right on the head with that one Lil....an example:

Our district does not allow cell phones to be used by students during the day. If they need to call anyone they are to use the office phone designated for that purpose only and is there for the convenience of the students. One day, during Math class 3 different students received phone calls from parents. The cell phones were confiscated (as per the student handbook that parents have to sign that they have read and agreed to) and the students were told they could pick them up at the end of the day when school got out. Well...a parent coundn't get a hold of her "angel" and called the superintendent who was in a meeting with the principal so he could track this child down. Thinking it was an emergency, he had the student pulled out of class and let her call her mom from his office. The emergency?

"Please pick up a gallon of milk on your way home from school."

I know that it may seem small, but when parents don't adhear to the rules of the district no matter how trivial they appear - and they are there for a reason, the kids feel as if they don't have to either. We have kids leaving the building when they want, if the assignment is too difficult or they just don't want to do it, a parent will excuse them and the teacher is to "give" them a grade...:( If a kid doesn't appear for a detention, the parent is called and some tell the principal that their kid isn't going to serve a detention no matter what. YES... some parents make the job of teaching very difficult.

There are also some teachers who have been teaching far too long and are burned out (for lack of a better description) and have a difficult time seeing the wonder of learning that can be found in any child no matter how terrible (or good) their behavior is.

[maddy]

Chey's above post adds to my theory on some sort of counseling/test should be necessary to be a parent.

[Sharni]

Sounds good in theory....but unsure how it'll work in practice

You dont know yourself how your gonna be as a parent before ya actually have kids....how the hell is someone else or a test sposed to figure that out *LOL*

[maddy]

I know I haven't been able to work it all out, it just seems to make some sense on a theoretical level. I don't know what it's like around the world, but in the states you have to take a test to drive a car. You have to get a license to get married, and in most church marriages you have to go through some sort of counseling. To get a job you have to interview. For so many of life's important aspects there is some "form" to complete and someone has to grant "approval" but not for pregnancy and parenthood. I know, my little departure from reality :)

[cowgirltease]

All I can say is if I would have pulled this crap at school when I was young......
First I would have got my ass busted at school then, When I got home I'd had gotten my ass busted TWICE as bad when I got home!
I think the root problem here is the parents not teaching their children to behave in public.

[Master Scribe]

Ya'll really do not want to know my point of view. I use to work in what was called an innner city school. O have been hit, injured, threated and generally mistreated and that was by the staff ( joking), but I know that sometimes kids go off for no apparent reason but because of the wonderful ideals of liberal thinkers who feel that a child has to feeel good about themselfs and that proper parenting never includes a good ass whooping we get to deal with this type of behavior from an 8 year old that will result in even more interesting behavior when he is 18

[PantyFanatic]

....because of the wonderful ideals of liberal thinkers who feel that a child has to feeel good about themselfs and that proper parenting never includes a good ass whooping we get to deal with this type of behavior from an 8 year old that will result in even more interesting behavior when he is 18
With the disclosure of some RARE, true child abuse cases……..

*enter- stage right* The LAWYERS:yikes:
*enter- stage left* The PSYCOLOGISTS:yikes:

Today the parents have the same (and often more) restrictions as to what discipline they are permitted to use with their children. Now the school systems and facility are exposed to anxious civil litigation:bang: and the parents are subject to criminal prosecution.:hair:

:bsflag:
GOD! I’m so glad this is behind me.

[Lilith]

I spend way too much time in dependency court to believe for one minute, at least in the judicial district I live in, that parents are being unduly charged criminally. It may happen but I bet the instances are extremely rare. Here everything must be investigated but the parents I see in dependency court, deserve to be there.

If there were a simple fix to the problem, somebody would have found it by now.

While some may not care for the book's author, I do buy into the "it takes a village to raise a child" theory. I'm the momma on my block who not only praises and disciplines her own kids but will not hesitate to treat any other neighborhood kids with the same expectations and respect as I do my own. It's a complacency problem, possibly, *shrugs* lowered expectations mayhaps.

[wyndhy]

any sort of behavioral conditions aside, it comes down to respect (or the lack of it rather) which can be taught in many ways, all of them effective. it is a parental issue/responsibility--to teach this to your child--but when the parent(s) fail(s), it it up to local mentors--be they other parents, authority figures or school teachers--to step in and take on the responsibility becasue this sort of misbeahavior, as evidenced by this news story, affects the entire communtiy on many levels--i would even go so far as to say it affects the *future of the community because one day these children will be in positions of power and there behavior will have even furthur reaching consequences.

[Stinger]

I do spank my kids and I do not have a problem if they were to have received a paddle in school. I know they will probably never bring it back in schools, but I would vote that they could. Being a parent of two kids, I tell them that if a teacher tells them something, it would be like if I told it to them and they better listen unless it had something that they questioned as if the teacher would touch them inappropriately.
I know that everyone is frustrated these days and it does start with the parents.
My son got in trouble on the bus a few months back and got kicked off for a week. Someone on the bus twisted his arm back and hurt him so he retaliated and hit him with his book bag. I had no problem with him getting kicked off because the bus driver doesn't have time messing with kids when she needs to be focusing on the road. What I did have a problem with is that the school didn't call my wife or I to discuss it with us. They said they don't do that anymore because when it comes to the bus because they have had nothing, but argumentative parents. I did ground my son for two weeks for being disruptive on the bus even though I didn't agree with it because he was defending himself, but I want to support the school as much as I can, but I told them they need to call me regardless and they cannot assume that all parents are going to be argumentative with them.
We cannot be with our kids 24/7 and we cannot assume they are always going to do the right thing even though we want to believe in them, they will mess up. And we are not going to bring them up right if we always try to shelter them from dealing with the consequences if they do wrong because when they are of legal age, we will not be able to keep them out of jail if they do something against the law.