Oh Shit!!!!!! No parallel universe?????

[Lilith]

How am I supposed to keep this shit straight if the genius keeps changing his mind :p????????

Hawkings (http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/space/07/21/hawking.blackholes.ap/index.html)

[Aqua]

Damn... Well Lilith... there's goes your chance of a 3-way with me and my alternate universe twin... Damn Geniuses... :p

[jseal]

Lilith,

Well, it helps to nudge Relativity Theory and Quantum Mechanics towards each other. New data from the Super-Kamiokande detector in Japan confirm that neutrinos change as they travel. This requires that they have some mass, and that is contrary to the Standard Model of Quantum Mechanics.

[Lilith]

Well I could never buy that neutrinos could pass through me and be unaffected so it meshes with my personal Quantum theory.

[PantyFanatic]

Lilith,

Well, it helps to nudge Relativity Theory and Quantum Mechanics towards each other. New data from the Super-Kamiokande detector in Japan confirm that neutrinos change as they travel. This requires that they have some mass, and that is contrary to the Standard Model of Quantum Mechanics.
Wasn't the neutrino mass confirmed with 87 or 88 B supernova (going from memory) in that same flooded lead mine?

How does this support unified theory?

[campingboy]

I'm putting my support behind Hawking's. Black holes are not a one way path. Mass does get released, just very disfigured.

For example, I pay Tax to that black hole called Ottawa. Occasionally I see something escaping from its gravitational pull, but it is so disfigured and contorted that it is only a small amount of what I sent.

[rockintime]

:D ^^^LMAO^^^ :D

Great one, campingboy!

[jseal]

PantyFanatic,

I think the first data supporting the theory that neutrinos had mass were reported in 1998 by physicists at the Super-Kamiokande detector in Japan, and subsequently confirmed at the Sudbury Neutrino Observatory in Canada, published in 2001. The most recent reports from Super-K are a refinement of the original work with some new data.

The Standard Model predicts that neutrinos have no mass and cannot change type. This led to the “solar neutrino problem”, when only about 30% of the predicted neutrinos were detected. The “type shifting” of neutrinos was first proposed to account for the delta between the theoretical and recorded counts.

I believe that there is no accepted Unified Theory yet. String Theory and Loop Quantum Gravity have yet to produce any theoretical predictions which can be tested.

Professor Hawking’s latest efforts seem to have been influenced by developments in Information Theory and the Generalized Second Law as described by Jacob Bekenstein. I will have to wait for a non-mathematical assessment of Professor Hawking’s Dublin paper.

[Cheyanne]

hmmmmmmm, I always thought Scott Bakula was sexy.. :p :dizzy:

[dreamgurl]

All this talk has left me more confused that usual and, that's hard to do.

[scotzoidman]

My take on all this can be explained in the last thought in my signature below...

[dicksbro]

I think Campingboy is right. I've seen the same thing happen to our tax money going to that great black hole called "Washington" or, by another name, the Great Abyss where the only thing that re-appears after are rich, ego-centric former representatives.

[LixyChick]

Well...I just got smarter at 5:51am.

I have to be in a parallel universe...or bizarro world at the very least!

LMFAO@Cheyanne! Scott Bakula is cute...I'd do him! And...his name is fun to say after tee many martuni's!

[jseal]

Gentlefolk,

While I may be pilloried for what I am about to say, I shall say it anyway.

Many years ago at Caltech, Richard Feynman, speaking about quantum theory, opened a lecture with “Do not take the lecture too seriously . . . just relax and enjoy it. I am going to tell you what nature behaves like. If you will simply admit that maybe she does behave like this, you will find her a delightful, entrancing thing. Do not keep saying to yourself ‘But how can it be like that?’ because you will get...into a blind alley from which nobody has yet escaped. Nobody knows how it can be like that."

It is prudent to take his warning seriously. If you try to picture the quantum world in familiar ways you will come hopelessly unstuck. The quantum world really is different, and the only way to come to grips with it is to suspend disbelief.

The reports of the last week; that neutrinos have mass, and that the event horizon of a black hole is permeable, provide us with clear evidence that the principle physical theories of nature, both the one that describes the infinitesimal, and the one that describes the infinitely large are incomplete, and may be replaced.

This is exciting science.

[Catch22]

If there is a parallel universe. You can be sure of one thing. Humans will try to fuck up whatever is there!

[Catch22]

Oh and your tax dollars go on fact finding tours to the Bahamas. So the folks there are the other end of the black hole!

[Steph]

Neutrinos sound like a delicious snack.

[Lilith]

They add kick to salsa too Steph.

[WildIrish]

The reports of the last week; that neutrinos have mass, and that the event horizon of a black hole is permeable, provide us with clear evidence that the principle physical theories of nature, both the one that describes the infinitesimal, and the one that describes the infinitely large are incomplete, and may be replaced.

This is exciting science.


Where does the universal constant fit into these theories, assuming it is connected with Hubble's of course. :confused:

[jseal]

WildIrish,

Before this week I didn't even know that neutrinos were Catholic - much less that they had Mass!


Talk about leading edge discoveries!

[lakritze]

This is what I have always liket about Richard Feynman, his belief that it is all just a game to play.Not to be taken seriously.

[Aqua]

I thought Neutrino was a new car... The Chevy El Neutrino... :p

[Catch22]

and we left out membrane theory.

http://webuser.fh-furtwangen.de/~webers/membthe1.htm

[WildIrish]

I find it hard to believe that such a complex hypothesis as the membrane theory could've come from FartWagon, Germany.

[Catch22]

I find it hard to believe that such a complex hypothesis as the membrane theory could've come from FartWagon, Germany.


No Fartwagon is in Austria.

[jseal]

...Fartwagon is in Austria.


See! God does NOT play dice with the Universe!

[WildIrish]

No Fartwagon is in Austria.

You mean Ass-tria. :D

[PantyFanatic]

jseal-

Exciting science it is indeed!:)!


Sorry my mundane attention has been focused elsewhere.

I found a number of references to SN87A & SN88B that I either do not have the software to open or document services that I do not subscribe to. I only vaguely recall the prediction of the neutrino subatomic particle being confirmed by the three experimental detectors at that time. Particle physics is far from my vocation and I was unaware of the Type Shifting concept. Last year was my only opportunity to attend a Hawking lecture, where his focus was relative to String and Brane considerations. My laymen’s perceptions are better able to accept his latest considerations. I wrestle at the gates of these fields.

I understand “Standard Model of Quantum Mechanics” to only be in a state of flux (no pun intended) and read the “nudge” as movement to TOE. It seems quantum will take many forms before we see a tunnel.

Devine coincidence-
Only because of many years of Dr. Feynman’s inspiration, it was just last week I was able to hear the Tuva Throat Singers here in Cleveland. :) Of his MANY unique and absorbing characteristics, I found his method of curiosity as appealing as the manner in which he just could never take himself too seriously. Not having his head up his own ass seemed to better his observations.;)

It’s 8 o’clock. Do you know where your bongos are tonight? ;)

[Oldfart]

I wondered how we could detect things without mass. A massless particle

would not have any effect on anything it struck, and would be invisible and

indetectable. Even light has sufficient mass to be able to impinge on detectors

such as photo-electric cells and retinas.

Hawking has never (that I am aware of) been able to tell us what happens to

matter as it passes the event horizon, whether it just turns to energy and

distorts space, or whether it is gradually turned into hadron soup.

Just because the escape velocity at the event horizon exceeds the average

speed of light does not mean that matter falling through the event horizon

exceeds the speed of light.

If the gravity well within the "black hole" is asymmetric, conditions may change

enough to allow the event horizon to recede below the matter, re-instating it

within normal space.

Hawking's eminence has stifled argument for years, maybe some will come out

now.

Shit, did I say that?

Enough of these physicks and sorcery.

Lil, can I come back as a neutrino and go through you sometime?

[Lilith]

It would be my pleasure;)

[Oldfart]

Nay, fair lady.

The pleasure would be largely mine.

[thedog]

Yeah! -- We've already fucked up this one. Next Universe please!!!

[jseal]

thedog,

Oh, I don't know about that. There are many places that are quite pleasant.

[thereIam]

thedog,

Oh, I don't know about that. There are many places that are quite pleasant.

Where? Could you please supply the exact location of these places so that we may assign the appropriate personnel to throughly desecrate them?

[jseal]

thereIam,

Why certainly:

Taj Mahal at dawn.
Tower of London
Eiffel Tower
Grand Canyon
Mt. Kilimanjaro
Rome
Cape Canaveral during a night launch.
Great Wall of China
Macao
Abu Simbel
Victoria Falls
The Pyramids and Sphinx at Gizeh
5,000 flamingos taking flight at Lakes Nakuru or Elementeita
Omdurman, where the Blue Nile meets the White Nile
The Greco-Roman façades at Petra
The coral reefs off the west coast of Saudi Arabia
Mardi Gras in New Orleans
Niagara Falls
The Red Fort, Delhi
Westminster Abbey
Cathedrals of Notre Dame and Chartres
Serengeti Plains
The coral reefs off the east coast of Africa
San Francisco in the evening

…and this doesn’t begin to do justice to the splendors of the world.

You’ll have to hurry. Some of these splendors have bee around for thousands of years – or more. Many of them are protected, so you’ll be hard pressed to desecrate them.

As for “fucking up” the universe…merely a phantasm of human arrogance.

[osuche]

Taj Mahal at dawn.
Tower of London
Eiffel Tower
Grand Canyon
Mt. Kilimanjaro
Rome
Cape Canaveral during a night launch.
Great Wall of China
Macao
Abu Simbel
Victoria Falls
The Pyramids and Sphinx at Gizeh
5,000 flamingos taking flight at Lakes Nakuru or Elementeita
Omdurman, where the Blue Nile meets the White Nile
The Greco-Roman façades at Petra
The coral reefs off the west coast of Saudi Arabia
Mardi Gras in New Orleans
Niagara Falls
The Red Fort, Delhi
Westminster Abbey
Cathedrals of Notre Dame and Chartres
Serengeti Plains
The coral reefs off the east coast of Africa
San Francisco in the evening

…and this doesn’t begin to do justice to the splendors of the world.



((((((((jseal)))))))) ~ thank you! You just reminded me why I love this place. But can we make sure NOT to add Mexico City to the list? :D

[Lilith]

You forgot to add~ In a swing in my backyard on an evening in mid March

[Catch22]

((((((((jseal)))))))) ~ thank you! You just reminded me why I love this place. But can we make sure NOT to add Mexico City to the list? :D


Perhaps in a parallel universe everywhere may be a Mexico city!!!

[Oldfart]

yes, sharing a swing in Lil's back yard, or sneaking her into one of the air-chairs

Mrs OF and I have in my car-port.

A loaf of bread, a jug of mudslide and thee?

[osuche]

Perhaps in a parallel universe everywhere may be a Mexico city!!!

Then I'm glad to know there are no parallel universes! Unless MC is also populated with Pixies people in this parallel universe... :p

[thereIam]

As for “fucking up” the universe…merely a phantasm of human arrogance.

Ahhh, but in our arrogance look what we have achieved so far:

Bikini Atoll
Chernobyl
Bhopal
deforestation of England
Dresden
Carthage
Wal Mart
New math
Mexico City

Where will it all end?

[jseal]

...Where will it all end?

thereIam,

In an evolved human species.

[Catch22]

So hell would be defiined as having to do Math in Mexico City. E=MexicoCitysquared

[jseal]

So hell would be defiined as having to do Math in Mexico City. E=MexicoCitysquared

Catch22,

I must admit that I never thought of it that way before!