Does it ever end?

[Irish]

I have never been much of a C&W fan.In all fairness,it has
changed alot.It used to be all nasely,twangy crap.I watched the
CW awards last night because my wife is a BIG CW fan.She likes
Toby Keith.She says that he reminds her of me when I was
younger.When he gave a concert to the troops,with the headband,goatee,medium length blond hair,etc.She says that it looks like a heavier,less muscular me.Anyway,last night he won
the most popular CW singer?This is what she told me afterwards.
I guess that it was between Toby,The Dixy Chix,and others.She was listening to a CW station,while driving to work this morning.
The disc jockey,said that Natalie had a shirt on last night in concert,that had the initials on it,that said:F.U.T.K.,supposedly
meaning F--K you,Toby Keith.He said that she is totally out of
control&that it's too bad that she's ruining the other two members
careers! Irish
P.S.Has anyone else heard of this?

[IggysGirl]

What I heard it is supposed to mean:
Freedom
Understanding
Tolerance
Knowledge

Kinda like the freedom of speech shirt she wore to another concert.

[jennaflower]

Yes.. I did.. and it only serves as a reminder to me that I will NEVER ever purchase any of the Dixie Bitch's music...

I enjoyed their music BEFORE their comment about Pres. Bush... and haven't listened to any of their music since. Natalie Maines's actions last night was only the nail in the coffin for me..

Before last night... I had a little bit of sympathy for the other 2 girls in the group.... today that sympathy is not there... the first comment about the Pres was supposedly off the cuff.. thus I didn't blame the other girls for the actions of the one... last nights subtle (if you want to say that) statement was something that they (the other two girls) could have stopped.. but chose not to... their problem now.

Her shirt most certainly said F.U.T.K. and no matter what anyone says, it was unnecessary and completely juvenile of her to do so. I think that these girls didn't have the guts to show up at the awards... and their time in the limelight has exceeded the welcome..

[jennaflower]

IggysGirl...

T.K. on the shirt.. SUPPOSEDLY meant Toby Keith.

The reason... the long fueled public dislike for what the other stands for..

When Toby Keith released "The Angry American", Natalie Maines came out publically and said that the song portrayed Americans to be ignorant, ellitest, etc...

When Natalie Maines made her comment about Bush, Toby Keith did not hesitate putting in his two cents...

and now.. Natalie has taken the next sucker punch...

Personally, I don't like Toby Keith much... but I do like the patriotism that the man stands for...

Rumor was that Toby Keith left the music awards early because he was pissed about Natalie's shirt... tho some reports I have heard was that he left because he didn't think he was gonna win and opted to go work on a song with Willie Nelson.

No one will ever know the exact reason... tho I would imagine that IF Toby was pissed... if he had gone back on that stage afterwards, it probably wouldn't have been pretty.

FYI... Toby is gonna be on the Jimmy Kimmel show tonight... might be interesting :)

[jseal]

Gentlefolk,

In re above:
http://entertainment.msn.com/news/article.aspx?news=123260

[IggysGirl]

Jenna Thanks I didn't know all that. I am not a big country fan but I do like certain songs by both DC and TK. Geez I thought pettiness like that ended once you got out of HS. If the shirt did mean fuck you then the DC are really asking for their career to be over.

[Sugarsprinkles]

Re: The Dixie Chicks AND Toby Keith.............




What ever happened to FREEDOM OF SPEECH????

Whether or not I agree or disagree with what they said, they had every right in the world to express their opinion. We all also have the right to buy or not buy their music. But I feel the radio stations continuing to boycott them months after their comments is nothing more than economic blackmail. I've stopped listening to my favorite Country music station because they are still refusing to play the Dixie Chicks music.

I watched the show last night.....I honestly didn't notice Natalie's shirt.

I think the entire audience was being juvenile by booing like they did. And if Toby Keith, whom I adore, left because of something as petty as letters on a shirt, then he's just as juvenile.

I think they ALL need to get over it. The Chicks have apologized, more than once. What more must they do? Wear Scarlet letters?
Go around in sackcloth and ashes? No matter what they do, they'll never satisfy everyone.

[jennaflower]

I am a complete supporter of the Freedom of Speech.. HOWEVER.. this situation has long ago passed the line..

Now.. I will not rehash more of the Bush thing than I did in my prior post above.. my opinion on that will not ever change..

I do agree, that it is in the past, but like all things, things done (whether positive or negative) are never forgotten. Yes, the actions between both the Dixie Bitches and TK linger on the juvenile side... but then again.. that is where the free speech goes into play... right?

I don't believe for a moment that TK's actions were at all selfish, or childish when it comes to his decision to leave. He is well known for being a man of strong conviction, and without a doubt he probably realized that IF he happened to get back up to the mic during the evening he might have stepped farther over the line than the event was deserving of. I think that TK has more respect for the event and his fellow entertainers to put a negative memory into that night... the same can't be said for Natalie.

There was NO reason for such a remark to be said.. and I do firmly believe that her choice to say it may signal the long overdue end to them

[Irish]

I ,almost ,always watch Jimmy Kimmel.He says it the way he feels it.I had it on after my exercises last night,but I fell asleep in my
recliner,so I didn't hear about Toby Keith being on.I'll watch it,tonight,for sure! Irish
P.S.I'm not sure what the FUTK meant.I only know what the
disc jockey said.If it did mean Fuck You.That did go out in High School!

[Irish]

Sugarsprinkles---Toby Keith,might have a temper,like mine!
I have,many times,walked outside,when my wife & I were
argueing,because I knew that I would say something,that I
really didn't mean.Juvenile?Maybe,but sometimes,descrestion
is the better part of valor! Irish

[Sugarsprinkles]

That may very well be the case Irish. But it would have been nice if he'd had them give some kind of believable excuse as to why he left. Just leaving without letting anyone know, no matter now good or understandable the reason was, at the very best thoughtless. Not so much the leaving, but the not at least 'appearing' to have a reason.

[DallasLiving]

Originally posted by Sugarsprinkles

What ever happened to FREEDOM OF SPEECH????

Whether or not I agree or disagree with what they said, they had every right in the world to express their opinion. We all also have the right to buy or not buy their music. But I feel the radio stations continuing to boycott them months after their comments is nothing more than economic blackmail. I've stopped listening to my favorite Country music station because they are still refusing to play the Dixie Chicks music.

I watched the show last night.....I honestly didn't notice Natalie's shirt.

I think the entire audience was being juvenile by booing like they did. And if Toby Keith, whom I adore, left because of something as petty as letters on a shirt, then he's just as juvenile.

I think they ALL need to get over it. The Chicks have apologized, more than once. What more must they do? Wear Scarlet letters?
Go around in sackcloth and ashes? No matter what they do, they'll never satisfy everyone.

Sugar, wouldn't the audiences booing and the listeners requesting the radio stations to not play their music, qualify as freedom of speech too?

I know here in Dallas they did a survey of the listeners and by a margin of more than 80% were against them playing the DC's music on the radio. And they listened to their listeners instead of losing them.

As far as them booing, supposedly at their first concert since all of this. Natalie even told people in the crowd to boo if they felt the need. Looks like the crowd in Vegas had the need.

[Eros]

I'm with Jenna on the "Dixie Bitch" thing. Had Natalie spouted off her now infamous comment during a US concert, then yes it's freedom of speech. But, like I've said earlier, the bitch didnt' have the balls to say it here..she said it in England. Toby is one of my favorite CW artitsts because of his conviction and patriotisim. I didn't watch the CMA's but if that's what her shirt meant, then I don't blame Toby for leaving early. Knowing Toby if he HAD stuck around after that...there would've been quite a few off color comments about the "Bitches". Again..just my 2 cents.

[BlondeCurlGirl]

*sigh* You are right Irish, it never ends... :confused:

[seriousfun]

I think Jenna and Irish know how I feel :D

In fact, ten times stronger than the last time we discussed this.

[jennaflower]

Serious...

Yep.. I know how ya feel on the subject.... anyway I can learn what you REALLY feel like? ROFL...



please excuse me.. woke up on the funny side of the bed today :)

[joenj]

I agree Sugarsprinkles. Freedom of Speech is one thing, but blacklisting is another. I saw on the news the other day that just before the war started, the Screen Actors Guild sent a letter to the major studios warning them not to even think of blacklisting actors that spoke out against the war since they knew someone would and did.

I think all of it should be left to the fans. If the fans don't buy their music or see their movies, that will hurt more than anything else. The pocketbook always rules.


Originally posted by Sugarsprinkles
Re: The Dixie Chicks AND Toby Keith.............




What ever happened to FREEDOM OF SPEECH????

Whether or not I agree or disagree with what they said, they had every right in the world to express their opinion. We all also have the right to buy or not buy their music. But I feel the radio stations continuing to boycott them months after their comments is nothing more than economic blackmail. I've stopped listening to my favorite Country music station because they are still refusing to play the Dixie Chicks music.

I watched the show last night.....I honestly didn't notice Natalie's shirt.

I think the entire audience was being juvenile by booing like they did. And if Toby Keith, whom I adore, left because of something as petty as letters on a shirt, then he's just as juvenile.

I think they ALL need to get over it. The Chicks have apologized, more than once. What more must they do? Wear Scarlet letters?
Go around in sackcloth and ashes? No matter what they do, they'll never satisfy everyone.

[Cheyanne]

I remember another feud that happened.... remember Billy Ray Cyrus and Travis Tritt? I just think the Dixie Chicks are being watched and nothing they do will be right.

[Sugarsprinkles]

Originally posted by Cheyanne
I just think the Dixie Chicks are being watched and nothing they do will be right.

Right, Cheyanne!

I think if the the media would just leave it alone, quit fueling the fire and if the Dixie Chicks would also stop calling attention to the controversy it would all blow over in time. Let the fans decide with their wallets.


joenj:

You're right...........this does smack of 1950's Hollywood blacklisting. And actually this is worse.............it's collusion by many radio stations to destroy careers simply because they disagree with the performers.

Since when is one group's FREEDOM OF SPEECH more important than another's????

[skipthisone]

Sorry SS, but freedom of speech is also granted to the owner's of the radio stations to not play the music. In my town, just like what was mentioned above they polled the listeners and out of 300 calls only 4 people wanted them to start playing the chicks again.

Thing we seem to have forgotten in this country is that yes we have freedom of speech, but actions have consequences.

[Irish]

Cheyanne---The thing that I liked best about Travis Tritt,is that
he was,supposedly,instrumental,in getting "The Eagles"back
together.
Sugarsprinkles---You are far to intelligent,to actually think that
socalled "apology"was sincere.I can "act" better than that and I
CAN'T act!It's not right,but people always remember you for
things in the past.I carry a photostatic copy of my "record
annulment"in my wallet.The 15th of June,will be 11yrs.since I
touched alcohol,but to some people,I will always be the "crazy"
speed freak,hard drinking,and always in some kind of trouble.
People remember you for the past,not what you do now.You
just have to "move-on"!I guess the people in Jimmys audience,
with the FUDC shirts,must have been using their "Free Speech"
rights!There is a big difference between,free speech"&insulting.
You can use free speech without being hurtfull!
Serious---Thanks,That site was very informative! Irish
P.S.My $.02.Different Strokes,for different folks!
You have to satisfy,the person that looks back from the mirror!

[Irish]

STO---It's rare that I say this,but I couldn't have said it better
myself.It's something like-For each & every action,there is an
equal & opposite reaction! Irish

[jseal]

Gentlefolk,

I may be old fashioned, but it seems to me that Ms. Maines et al have rediscovered some part of what wisdom may be found in Galatians 6: 7-10, which in some translations, reads “He who soweth the wind reapeth the whirlwind”.

The Dixie Chicks made a calculated gamble to pander to the crowd of the moment and are surprisingly (to me) still paying the price.

[Sugarsprinkles]

Originally posted by skipthisone

Thing we seem to have forgotten in this country is that yes we have freedom of speech, but actions have consequences.

Not for everyone, it seems. Jane Fonda, for example. What she did during Vietnam was so much worse than what the Dixie Chicks had to say. But look at her career in the years following. She continued to make movies, even won an Oscar. Then later she made millions, maybe even billions off her excercise tapes. Gotta love those consequences!!!!
Seems some of us can forgive someone for "aiding and abetting the enemy", but not others for simply expressing an opinion.
And the Chicks never said anything against our GOVERNMENT or against our MILITARY, only against the President. Seems to me that people have been expressing opinions against presidents ever since the first GW....George Washington.
Don't misunderstand me......I have never and will never forgive "Hanoi Jane" for her actions and statements against our government and most especially against our military men. I'm just using her as an example.

This is all I have to say about the issue. No sense beating a dead horse. And this will never blow over if we keep rehashing it over and over.

[jseal]

Sugarsprinkles,

There are exceptions to all rules, including, if you’ll believe Kurt Gödel, the rule which states that there are exceptions to all rules.

Ms. Maines is being judged by the standards of today, while the excesses of Ms. Fonda occurred thirty odd years ago. As I recall, the scene was rather different then than now.

I am loath to describe that period as either better or worse than today, but it was definitely different.

[skipthisone]

just going to say that Jseal, people are smarter and better informed now than in the 60's

[seriousfun]

Originally posted by jennaflower
Serious...

Yep.. I know how ya feel on the subject.... anyway I can learn what you REALLY feel like? ROFL...



please excuse me.. woke up on the funny side of the bed today :)

Feel me :p she said feel me :p

Cum on over, and you'll know exactly how I feel:D :sex: either side of the bed is fine

[Irish]

People are better informed now,but I(my opinion)don't believe
that they are any smarter!All that I know is that I,or any of
the POWs,will never forgive or forget"Hanoi Jane"It's easy to
afford to look good,when you have Ted Turners money.Plastic
surgery isn't that expensive,with that kind of money.I rebuilt
the engine in the boat that ,supposedly burned in"On Lost
Pond",one of her movies.The boats in that movie,are owned by
a Pat Curtain(sp?)He owns the marina,between,the Burger
King&the Bonanza Steak House,in Laconia NH.Therefore,I know a
little about her! Irish

[joenj]

On Golden Pond?


Originally posted by Irish
People are better informed now,but I(my opinion)don't believe
that they are any smarter!All that I know is that I,or any of
the POWs,will never forgive or forget"Hanoi Jane"It's easy to
afford to look good,when you have Ted Turners money.Plastic
surgery isn't that expensive,with that kind of money.I rebuilt
the engine in the boat that ,supposedly burned in"On Lost
Pond",one of her movies.The boats in that movie,are owned by
a Pat Curtain(sp?)He owns the marina,between,the Burger
King&the Bonanza Steak House,in Laconia NH.Therefore,I know a
little about her! Irish

[Irish]

joenj---Yes,sorry,I stand corrected.As you can tell,I'm not a great
movie buff.Plus,your memory,starts to fade, when you reach my age.As long as my penis works,it's OK tho! Irish

[jseal]

Skipthisone,

That might depend on the particulars…

For example, the people seem not to have been better informed by the American and British intelligence services about the existence of Iraq’s WMDs.

Smarter? What about the defunding of therapeutic cloning? What about the on-going debate about the “theories” of Evolution and Creationism?

On balance, I suspect that humans are about the same now as they ever have been since they could be called humans. What changes over time is what they hold to be true.

[skipthisone]

Originally posted by jseal
For example, the people seem not to have been better informed by the American and British intelligence services about the existence of Iraq’s WMDs.

Smarter? What about the defunding of therapeutic cloning? What about the on-going debate about the “theories” of Evolution and Creationism?

I guess I am being optimistic about the people living today. On the 1st one, I think that everyone was very well informed and that we still are....but I wont get into that here.

The 2nd...that battle will go on forever as long as some have faith in one or the other. In one form or another it has gone on for the entire thinking life of this planet.

[joenj]

I saw this awhile back and saved it. I think it says tons about the difference between now and many years ago.

According to today's regulators and bureaucrats, those of us who were kids in the 30's, 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's or even the early 80's, probably shouldn't have survived.

Our baby cribs were covered with bright colored lead-based paint. We had no childproof lids or locks on medicine bottles, doors, or cabinets, and when we rode our bikes, we had no helmets. Not to mention the risks we took hitchhiking.

As children, we would ride in cars with no seat belts or air bags. Riding in the back of a pickup truck on a warm day was always a special treat. We drank water from the garden hose and not from a bottle. Horrors! We ate cupcakes, bread and butter, and drank soda pop with sugar in it, but we were never overweight because we were always outside playing. We shared one soft drink with four friends, from one bottle, and no one actually died from this.

We would spend hours building our go-carts out of scraps and then rode down the hill, only to find out we forgot the brakes. After running into the bushes a few times, we learned to solve the problem. We would leave home in the morning and play all day, as long as we were back when the street lights came on. No one was able to reach us all day. No cell phones. Unthinkable!

We did not have Playstations, Nintendo 64, X-Boxes, no video games at all, no 99 channels on cable, video tape movies, surround sound, personal cell phones, personal computers, or Internet chat rooms. We had friends! We went outside and found them.

We played dodge ball, and sometimes, the ball would really hurt. We fell out of trees, got cut and broke bones and teeth, and there were no lawsuits from these accidents. They were accidents. No one was to blame but us. Remember accidents?

We had fights and punched each other and got black and blue and learned to get over it. We made up games with sticks and tennis balls and, although we were told it would happen, we did not put out any eyes. We rode bikes or walked to a friend's home and knocked on the door, or rang the bell or just walked in and talked to them. Little League had tryouts and not everyone made the team. Those who didn't had to learn to deal with disappointment. Some students weren't as smart as others, so they failed a grade and were held back to repeat the same grade. Horrors! Tests were not adjusted for any reason. Our actions were our own. Consequences were expected. The idea of parents bailing us out if we got in trouble in school or broke a law was unheard of. They actually sided with the school or the law. Imagine that!

This generation has produced some of the best risk-takers, problem solvers, and inventors, ever. We had freedom, failure, success, and responsibility --- and we learned how to deal with it. And you're one of them! Congratulations.

[skipthisone]

Still love that joenj...(I think Irish posted that sometime before..you are thinking like Irish now :D)....is still good.

[Lilith]

Originally posted by Irish
Does it ever end?

:rolleyes: apparently not~rotflmao

[jseal]

Lilith,

The reason that this and all public forums exist is that it never does.

[jseal]

Gentlefolk,

...which is why we keep returning.

[jennaflower]

Okay... here goes (SS.. I promised last night to be kind, but that was last night. LOL)

From what I have read (with the exception of the boards that cater to the Dixie Bitches) the majority of Americans feel as I do regarding them... they aren't worthy of my money, my time, or my admiration.... I reserve my right to use direct those things to people who really deserve it.

Just as it was Ms. Maines choice to exercise her right to Free speech, it is also my right to completely disagree with her and boycott her and anything that she is remotely involved in. I will not line her pockets, will not encourage her self esteem, will not in any way have her profit from my exsistence.

I still do not agree with what Ms. Maines did in Germany... I still believe very strongly that by doing so she proved her self to be a coward unable and unwilling to express herself within reach of those she slandered or those who would disagree with her. She would have never had the balls to do such a thing in the united states. Want proof of that? The events of the other night should be proof enough. Not only did they choose not to appear at the awards show, but then they chose to make a statement once again slandering someone else and far enough removed where they were not in any jeopardy.

The actions of Ms. Maines the other night just solidifies the opinion of those like me who truly can't stand her. Any chance that she thought she had after her completely fake "apology" is once and for all gone.

As for Mr. Keith, as I stated above, I have never been a huge fan of his. I can say tho, that over the past 2 years, that has slowly begun to change. Why? Because he is a man who speaks his mind, who supports our Country (and everything it stands for), supports our troops, and is a wonderful talent.

Yes, it can be said that Ms. Maines is only guilty of speaking her mind as well. The difference? Simple... Ms. Maines doesn't give a rats ass as to who will be injured by the crap she spews... Mr. Keith obviously does. Do you really think that leaving the award show early prior to getting some much deserved recognition was easy for him? HELL NO!!! But without a doubt in my mind he knew that taking the chance of getting that mic again and tarnishing the night for everyone else was too great a risk. Sorry but his leaving only showed that he respects not only his fellow entertainers but also the fans and the award show.

Dixie Chicks Be GONE!!!

As for Jane Fonda... she is far from a national treasure... a national disgrace she will be... she will not be remembered for her acting.. for her money.. for anything she has done on this earth expect for the traitor that she will always be... what a great legacy to have...

[quisath]

I have no problem with Free Speech and Natalie can say whatever she wants as a Free American.

But my right as a Free American I choose to NOT waste my Hard earned Money on anything the Dipsy Chicks have to sell. The little stunt the other night was uncalled for. I like true Patriots..................Toby is a Prime example of what American needs more of. I know you remember this one Irish............ "AMERICA............LOVE IT or LEAVE IT"